p3x.deBig hugs
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Lady Butterflyhttps://lazysoci.al/pictrs/image/889f1272-e53a-4143-b255-e1322ff01631.jpeg
https://lazysoci.al/pictrs/image/889f1272-e53a-4143-b255-e1322ff01631.jpeg
And now the cropping is fixed, so the comments deriding the cropping don't make sense anymore.
The sad thing is, some physical issues are treated like that. "Just walk it off", "you're just imagining it", "she's just hysterical, nothing wrong with her." Between the misogyny, machismo, and profiteering there's so much preventable suffering and death...
The confusion it will cause...
The medication stigma is based on basically magic thinking: That medicine is alien, external, unnatural while the human body is pure and natural. Therefore any difference between medicated and unmedicated is artificial and caused by the medicine.
No, the body is fucking dropping terror chemicals in my bloodstream. It is changing my personality from easygoing and outgoing to snippy and reclusive. The body is malfunctioning and changing my personality for the worse.
The medicine is reducing the amount and effectiveness of the body's excess of terror chemicals. It restores normality.
But no one thinks the same about statins, for example
It's not medication, it's medication that addresses mental illness
Nah, I ran into it going on thyroid hormones too. My parents had a couple church friends that were absolutely adamant that I needed to take the 'natural' desiccated pig thyroid instead of the 'unnatural' synthetic thyroid hormones. Their faith said that their god doesn't make mistakes, that either he wants you to have this condition, or he's provided a perfect natural remedy, so synthetic medicines existing is hubris.
It's more common with mental health meds, but it's not like there's a law saying it's the only meds people can be shitty about.
hugs you
I know this doesn't change what your body is doing to you, but I hope it at least makes you feel loved.
Thanks, friend! I'm all in all in a consistent good place and living a very active functional life, but it's 30% medication, 30% being stubbornly careful of what I let into my head, and 40% luck.
"Don't you think that eating healthy food every days is changing you from who you really are?"
munches on bacon flavored doritos judgingly
theres also the possibility that life today is truly a terrible situation for many, and your body refuses to lie to itself.
and its way better than it usually has been.
For me, I have a stigma to medication because the side effects are terrifying. I almost died from SSRIs, I got very ill and also suicidal. On benzos, I got paradoxically anxious and angry after cessation/when I wasn't taking them (I am not an angry person). I took them as prescribed - always.
I only got more and more unstable after taking various psychiatric drugs, and everyone in my family who has taken psychiatric drugs was not better off for it. Seems like suicidal ideation is a common reaction for those in my family. Perhaps there is a genetic cause for it, like how we metabolize drugs.
I don't know a single person in my life who has had a good experience, but if you or someone you know has had a good experience, I'm happy for you. It's just unfair to say it's magical thinking when there are real life reasons why people are hesitant.
ok, but in america this IS how physical diseases are created
In the four european countries I’ve lived in as a physically disabled person unable to work, this is exactly how I’ve been treated as well.
Good advice is to look at what America does, and do the opposite.
Source: American citizen
Me: Doc, I'm in constant pain, my lower back is killing me, my hips are killing me, and random parts of my body go numb or twitch and randomly hurt for no rhyme or reason.
Doc: You need to lose weight and see a therapist, this is most likely depression and anxiety.
Therapist: Yes, you have depression and anxiety, but the 7 years of therapy you've had shows it's not just anxiety or depression causing this, advocate for yourself.
Friend: Have you tried yoga?
If you say 'mental illness' 3 times in the mirror, someone with a Live Laugh Love t-shirt will appear behind you and ask if you've tried going outside.
Haha brilliant 😄
1, 4, and 6 is how my mom is about flu, cold, medicine.
When you're sick you need to rest and let your body do its thing. You can eat food containing the resources your body needs to potentially speed up recovery. But ultimately you need rest.
Not according to mom.
You have to work your flu out. If you're lying in bed feeling like shit you're just being lazy. You'll stay sick longer if you don't work, so out of bed you go. Come on, it's like you're not even trying to get better!
And of course the medicine your doctor gives you is just poison, because doctors don't know anything and just want to keep their career. Here, have these homeopathic pills instead.
Agoraphobia is a really fun one. “Just go outside! You’ll feel better if you hang out with people!” I’d love to! I’d love for my brain to not put up a great big roadblock that says “you are not going to be able to go into Walmart” or “you cannot complete that piece of paperwork.” That’s the problem I have. If it was as simple as just doing the thing, I’d be doing the thing.
I'll be honest, going outside does help. The problem is when you don't have a compelling enough reason to (in my personal experience. This might not be everybody's experience)
You can go buy beer or something.
Mental illness and alcohol is not something I want to mix
Yeah at least i know getting drunk makes me more depressed not less
If it made you less depressed, you can easily become an alcoholic
I'm an alcoholic, definitely makes me more depressed.
Then why do you drink? Sorry that this question is so blunt, lol
Welcome to the Netherlands...
Just take a paracetamol
It's not comparable. Whenever I see these posts, it always feels as if the author is suggesting that mental illness is just like a flu, you just get it accidentally and can't help it and you just need to rest to get over it.
But that is completely wrong. Unless you have developed schizophrenia or bipolar etc, that's a whole different kettle of fish which will likely require medication for the rest of your life. You need to help yourself out of depression and anxiety etc. You can't wait around for it to disappear, you need to see a therapist, take your ass outside and force yourself into uncomfortable situations.
You'll have days you can't do anything and that's completely okay. But I feel like the 'nurturing' of mental health can do some harm.
I feel you might be missing the joke, from my interpretation of it you are in agreement.
My read is that it is implying that mental illness are real diseases, but they're treated like you should just get over them, which would be ridiculous if you were bleeding out, but since they aren't usually visible people will just tell you that you should just be better.
See Soteria Houses. Schizophrenia or psychosis is not always a permanent state that requires medication for the rest of the patient's life. Soteria Houses achieve remission in individuals with little to no psychiatric medication. They use antipsychotics for stabilization, in controlled doses, and usually (to the best of my knowledge) only for a few months - though every case is different.
Okay, see 'likely'.
Who is going to tell them?
(I have seen a few of these very examples.)
Especially the first one
Yeah, about that... my Depression-raised dad didn't even think physical problems were an excuse for slacking or being negative. I think it was the general mood of the 30s when he was a teenager. There was very little public help for people in trouble - basically you could turn to charity or starve. So people were highly motivated to keep going in spite of whatever happened. Bouncing back from problems ASAFP was a survival trait. I always said if my dad saw me get my leg cut off by a chainsaw or something, he would probably run over and say cheerfully, "Oh well, you've still got your other leg, just hop!"
Because medical science really has very little understanding of how mental illness happens, most of thier treatment boils down to "deal with it". Medications help treat some symptoms, but often with lots of side effects.
So really the way we treat mental illness is often simply all we have. And that is the real problem.
We are still in the dark ages of medicine. People like to refer to modern medicine, but we are far from it. If we mobilized even half the amount of population that currently works on war related efforts, we would see astounding progress.
But it is modern! We already have germ theory, we know about inoculation and have a hazy idea that our endocrine system is very important. And yes, here is where all your words ring true.
I used to be way more sceptical towards any brain-chemistry-tampering compound, as I prejudged doctors to behave as they are next to an assembly line, prescribing chemicals based on archaic formulas. I'd hate to be stuck in a half-zen state married to some foreign chemistry with myriads of side effects. That is what I was seeing.
Then a friend had a pretty graceful mental breakdown. He couldn't sleep and he institutionalized himself farely quickly. Rivotril or something along those lines let him sleep. And then he was put on antidepressants (seratonin reuptake inhibitors , if I'm not mistaken, which was a huge bogeyman for me), was gliding on them for about a month or so, then weened off. I was seriously surprised that such an episode can be handled so well and so quickly without any residual medicating.
I think they didn't fix the underlying issues, but were able to unlock a cramp. I believe my friend has a fresh chance to figure out what brought him to that type of collapse and adjust his life accordingly.
All this said, even with the shittiest medications, it can definitely be worth being locked into some medicine than being a pool of dysfunction lying on the floor or causing major harm to your loved ones. I mean a good ayahuasca session gets a person pretty far, but not everything can be psychosomatic.
You are right to judge, but better off appreciating how far we come. Also thank you for expressing your opinion on it. I almost came in with an 'acktchually' after reading the comic, even though I agree and it resonates, it's such a delicate topic. I guess you got dosed with my contrarianism instead of OP!
It has improved since the dark ages, but it's still the same approach. Trial and error. And we still treat many illnesses by poisioning the body and hoping we kill the disease before the patient (chemotherapy, and actually antibiotics), just like leeches. And most treatments aren't even specifically delivered to the site of the issue. We swallow them and let themspread everywhere. So we have to take way more to get the concentration we need where we need it.
You need look no further than at the abysmal suscess rate of stage 3 trials to see that they have no idea what a medication will do to most of the body.
We can split the atom, walk on the moon, and annilate every human on the planet. But we can't even reliably cure a headache, or even stop pain. We can dull your mind so you don't care about the pain with addictive substances that have lots of side effects, or we can knock you out (and only most of the time wake you up).
We need more understanding. We need better diagnostic tooling. We don't even have a non-invasive way to reliably tell if an illness is viral or bacterial for a reasonable enough price to use it often.
Where's the sports ball coach saying "walk it off" to a person with no legs?
If you have a physical illness you go to physical therapy, so if you have a mental illness you should go to mental therapy.
Yeah definitely feel like at least in America we treat physical illness that way a lot of the time too
Awful cropping
Thanks Ive changed it
I agree with the message but its not entirely true becsuse once you treat the gaping wound, going on walks and just basic physical activity actually helps. It sounds stupid but touching grass is one of the best things you can do when youre in a bad place. Also this one adresses like one of the slides, the rest is bullshit people constantly tell eachother. Actually looking at the person on a deeper level and not just the surface helps a lot. What doesnt help is most people depressed nowadays arent depressed from some personal thing but from the cold hard truth that the world is a horrible place thats falling apart.
As the closest friend of someone depressed, I have to say such illness isn't the same as physical illness. Sure all those advices won't change anything, but that's just because the person doesn't have the will to make them happen. People around the depressed person can definitely help, just by spending time with the person, and encouraging the person to accompany them to activities. Biggest danger is insisting too much as you might turn into a burden. Sometimes I think it's just better not to talk
Yeah, that would be weird. Except physical illnesses and mental illnesses are not exactly the same.
The difference is that when you're physically sick, there usually isn't much you can do to help yourself, but there's a lot you can do about many mental illnesses. I'm not saying it's easy or that mentally ill people don't need support and care, but these are not comparable.
That's exactly what I'm saying. I don't agree with the comic.
they are, though. My nerve pain, dysautonomia, and chronic fatigue from long COVID are all dismissed as being just in my head
Generally agree but nr 4 pushes the stigma aspect. You should not be needing to take mental health medication every day just because you need to slave for some rich dick.
If you are free of stressing components like a toxic workplace, toxic friends, social pressure and alienation and still feel like you need chemical help and/or you literally have hallucinations, then you should medicate. Currently the vast majority is medicating (anecdotal) to cope with the shithole we live in.
Deleted by author
Thats not what I said but okay. I even put a marker on my text that it was anecdotal. Cant help there I think.
A LOT of people suffer from society and the pile of shit we're turning the world into. A LOT of people who do suffer dont even understand they do. And of course some people have no other choice but my point was that a lot (in my experience) dont even entertain the thought.
Thanks, I got confused on what both the comic and you were saying!
I medicate because otherwise I'd get nothing done. And that's not just work related, I mean my own personal projects and hobbies.
I used to think I could get by without, but as I turned 30 and was still procrastinating 90% of my free time away despite me desperately wanting to do something and that in turn also affecting my personal relationships. I needed to go sell help for medication. Even though I wasn't hallucinating.
You could also look at it like, you were conditioned to think that procrastinating/being unproductive is a bad thing. In the end, it could be that the things you do while procrastinating are the things you actually want, and the other stuff is just stuff that you think you're supposed to do.
Of course, you know yourself best. But for me, once I started seeing the procrastination activities as the actual activities I want to do, I really just stopped doing most of the other stuff, and now I'm entirely unproductive, not doing anything much, and I'm the happiest I've ever been.
It depends very heavily on what one does while procrastinating and whether I feel like I am avoiding doing the thing that I want/should be doing and how I feel about it afterwards. If I choose to play games instead of cleaning, that doesn't even feel like procrastination for me, it was just choosing something else.
But if I'm choosing something else just to avoid doing the other thing then it feels like procrastination. Right now I'm procrastinating by making this post instead of replying to something I don't want to deal with. That is different than when I choose to browse and post instead of cleaning if I just feel like browsing more than cleaning. That's just prioritizing.
Ugh, I should really stop procrastinating and deal with that other thing. Maybe I'll procrastinate some more by cleaning instead of dealing with that thing...
True. What happens if you don't do the other thing you're avoiding right now?
The problem gets worse as more and more people overreact to a misunderstanding. I did take care of it shortly after posting.
If the thing I am avoiding doesn't have negative consequences then I don't feel like avoiding it is procrastination, just choosing something else. That is the difference for me.
For example, avoiding cleaning is only procrastination if there is a negative consequence like mold buildup or it causes issues my sinuses to have a fit from excess dust. Or if being disorganized hinders my ability to do the things I want. For me, procrastination isn't defined by someone else.
Nah i have loads of things i want to do do, personal programming projects, woodworking, DIY but instead I would just watch YouTube and play games because they were easier
And thats totally fine. I didnt say dont use medication. I said stop the stigma.
Fair
I genereally agree, but I feel some nuance is missing: That is assuming a "harmful" environment is total toxicity and something you can just leave with no ill effects.
Sometimes the environment that hurts you is normal-ish and even "nice", but you personally are sensitive to some aspects of it, making it exhausting. It gives you purpose and happiness and you may not want to leave it.
Sometimes you have to stick to a harsh job because you have responsibilities. I'd rather take reasonably harmless medicine like melatonin and beta blockers to reduce the effects of stress and have a fulfilling life raising and supporting my kids, than saying "Work and life makes dad sad. I need to move to Spain and be a bartender at a beach. Sorry kids, I'm sure someone will find you a foster home bye."
Sure, nuance all day. I agree that i havent pointed out every aspect but as you said, the general point is valid.
Sounds like daddy needs a workers revolution.
That was essentially my point.
People act this way because they know how cold and callous the world is. No one cares if you have a mental disorder or psychological difficulties and if you are unable to hold down a job your future will take place living in the street. It is a harsh and brutal reality. Good luck.
I care, and I know a lot of other people do as well.
Caring is something you do not something you feel. What exactly do you do to help them?
Well considering that a lot of people suffering are experiencing economic problems in my country or problems with their environment; like not being able to receive health care and suffering from treatable physical illness, not being able to get out of sticky situations with abusive people or dynamics, having employment issues, or being homeless/in debt and so forth - I can't exactly give them a place to live or give them money because I really have none to give.
In those cases, what can I personally do for them? Of course I can listen, I can give solicited advice, and I can point them to the resources they have access to.
I advocate for those resources to be more accessible for all. Health-allowing, I want to volunteer my time and become more politically active.
Oh I'm sorry i misread your response. You're saying you don't do anything to help them but you want to seem like you do. That you're a fake ass poser, pretending to care in some virtue signaling fraud so others will think favorably of you even though you haven't actually done anything to deserve it. Now I understand. Like I said at the start of this waste of time of a conversation, the vast majority of people don't care.
I am not doing well. It's not an excuse and it doesn't make me lesser. I am working to be healthy. You are free to perceive reality however you wish, I choose to believe the world is a friendly place. If I was healthy, I would be able to do more for myself as well as others.
I have experienced some pretty terrible things. I know very well that life can be unkind, but I still persevere and I'm working towards healing. Thanks for your feedback, not everybody is the saint you expect them to be, but it doesn't make them lesser or bad.
So you are saying that you go to homeless camps and explain to them what resources are available to them and personally assist them with applying for those resources?
Considering that I have volunteered my time to help and feed the homeless when I was healthy, and have volunteered a significant amount of time in my life, I'd be willing to if I had an organization alongside me.
Why do you feel the need to purity test me?
None of this has anything to do with our conversation and I have no tests for you. I hope you the best and good luck.